Caria manor

Looking for help now

Password will be gg123 at fog wall

I've gotten to Caria Manor, but I've understood so little of what's going on. For one, who are the ghoulish mages and standard bearers I'm killing? (Am I the baddy?) What videos can I watch to catch up on the lore up until this point in the game (and history of the world)?

Doing my first go through and want to use a basic bones block/parry build. As I understand it, the ash I need is in the Caria Manor, and most of the other stuff is in Stormvale. So debating the pros and cons of hitting which one first.
As this point, I'm leaning towards going to the manor first, because, despite the walk, it should allow me to start learning parry timing sooner. Looking at the core bosses, I sort of think they're probably similar difficulty, though I'd expect the Manor region to have stronger base enemies.
I'm given to understand the castle has the bucker, but I still need to get through a greater for to get to it, plus I want a knightish type character for this run.
Wanted to get peoples' thoughts and opinions.
Thank you,
Harry Voyager

I just beat Rennala and cleared out Caria Manor, have explored Ainsel River and Siofra River as well as progressing Ranni's, Blaidds, and white masks story lines. What next? Caelid? The lift?
I'd like to platinum the game at the end, don't want to ruin anything for myself.
TIA

Reposted because I made a mistake
Can the characters from my favorite childhood shows are sent to Elden Ring and have to complete these tasks, they start in/around the church of Elleh
Note: this is not a complete list of every location and boss in the game since I haven’t completed it yet)
Take control of/clear all enemies in… (not in this specific order)
Castle Morne
Castle Redmane
Stormveil Castle
Siofra river
Rays Lucaria Academy
Caria Manor
The Shaded Castle
Volcano Manor
Royal Capital Leydell
Kill…
Margit the fell omen
Godrick the grafted
General Rahdan
Rennala
Magma wyrm makyr
Draconic tree sentinel
Godfrey, the first elden lord
Fire giant
Melania
Characters (in order of who I think will do best to worst)
The Amazing World Of Gumball
Legends of Chima (composite, this means every character featured in the show and games working together to accomplish a common goal)
Ninjago composite
Teen titans go composite (I’m sorry I watched this awful show growing up)
TTG main characters (Robin, Cyborg, Beast Boy, Starfire, Raven)
Ninjago main characters (Kai, Zane, Cole, Jay, Lloyd, Nya, Garmadon, master Wu)
LoC main characters (Laval, Cragger, Eris, Worriz, Rogon, Razar, Gorzan, Bladvic)

I swear I saw an NPC silhouette on the first floor in the room with Pidia (though it's not Pidia, he's on the second floor). He looked like a carian knight whom I'd fought in Raya Lucaria academy (miniboss just before Renalla).
Does anybody know who was that NPC?

Firstly, what is Grace? Mechanically it is a feature to guide the player towards objectives laid out by ______. Grace allows us to rest, gives us an opportunity to turn our runes into strength, and appears to us as a guiding light towards various things in the world. Pretty easy explanation for a game mechanic to help establish check points and a bit of a 'nudge' on where to go in a vast open world. It's also what allows us to 'respawn' after dying. FROM being the beautiful lil BAMFs that they are - wanted to give these mechanics meaning and story to justify their existence. That brings us to a second question - what is Grace from a lore perspective? This seems like a question that can be easily answered the same way the first question was explained, but mechanics aside this allows us to ask a few additional questions.
What is Grace leading us to?
Why are we led to the things Grace leads us to?
When did this start? When was Grace returned?
Who blessed us with Grace?
I'm going break down my interpretation of Grace in the post below. Feel free to agree or disagree - I love conversations about lore. My interpretation of the story and lore is constantly evolving when I'm exposed to new theories so I welcome the discussion!
A couple of NPC's speak to us about Grace throughout the game. Melina and Varre both explain Grace to us at the start of our journey.

White mask Varre:
Are you familiar with grace? The golden light that gives life to you Tarnished. You may also behold its golden rays pointing in a particular direction at times. That is the guidance of grace. The path that a Tarnished must travel. Mm, indeed. Grace's guidance holds the answers. It will lead you Tarnished to the path you are meant to follow. Even if it leads you to your grave.
Melina:
This tiny golden aura is the grace of the Erdtree. This light once shone in the eyes of your Tarnished brethren. But now it is all that guides you. Or so I hear. The rays of grace, that guide you through your burden. Upon the cliff, in Castle Stormveil, is a shardbearer. A demigod who inherited a fragment of the shattered Elden Ring. If the rays of grace signal the castle, then the Elden Ring beckons you. As an ally by pact,...I pray that you are fit... To face the challenge presented by the Ring.

Grace is what gives the Tarnished life, and allows us to resurrect after we die, as well as a guide through the Lands Between.
What are we being guided to? Well, let's take a look.
Limgrave
Liurnia
Caelid
Altus Plateau
Mountaintops
Underground
Seems pretty consistent if you ask me. We're clearly being guided to Demigods and shardbearers. Something wants us to claim Great Runes and slay the remaining demigods. There are 3 outliers with Grace that this doesn't really fit. Castle Morne doesn't really have anything that pertains to the goal of becoming Elden Lord besides getting stronger. Church of the Plague in Caelid hosts Millicent. She has a quest that could in theory lead to an Age of Rot (not a foolproof theory but that is how I interprete what Gowry is using Millicent for) Castle Sol is another funky one. I suppose you could claim this is leading us to Malenia. Still rather meh but let's keep going.
We've established what Grace is doing, as well as where it's leading us. Let's see if there's anything that could possibly pinpoint us as to when Grace was returned to us.
Let's consult the opening cinematic that plays when you select New Game

The fallen leaves tell a story.
The great Elden Ring was shattered.
In our home, across the fog, the Lands Between.
Now, Queen Marika the Eternal is nowhere to be found,
and in the Night of the Black Knives, Godwyn the Golden was the first to perish.
Soon, Marika's offspring, demigods all, claimed the shards of the Elden Ring.
The mad taint of their newfound strength triggered the Shattering.
A war from which no lord arose.
A war leading to abandonment by the Greater Will.
Arise now, ye Tarnished.
Ye dead, who yet live.
The call of long-lost grace speaks to us all.
Hoarah Loux, chieftan of the badlands.
The ever-brilliant Goldmask.
Fia, the Deathbed Companion.
The loathsome Dung Eater.
And Sir Gideon Ofnir, the All-knowing.
And one other. Whom grace would again bless.
A Tarnished of no renown.
Cross the fog, to the Lands Between.
To stand before the Elden Ring.
And become the Elden Lord.

This is the first exposition given to us - the Shattering War ended in a stalemate leading to the Greater Will abandoning the Demigods. The next thing it shows is Grace being returned to the Tarnished. This establishes pretty firmly that the Tarnished weren't called back until after The Shattering. The Greater Will abandoned the Demigods then proceeds to show Grace being returned to the Tarnished.
Also note that it says Marika is nowhere to be found since the Elden Ring was shattered. Enia backs this up when we speak to her about this:

Queen Marika is the vessel of the Elden Ring, carrier of its vision. A god, in truth. But after the Elden Ring's shattering, she was imprisoned in the Erdtree. A grim punishment for shattering the Order, despite her godhood. The Fingers speak...
"Marika's trespass demanded a heavy sentence. But even in shackles, she remains a god, and the vision's vessel. Confer Great Runes to become Elden Lord, and join Queen Marika as her consort. The Fingers have willed it so"

It's easy to get caught up in our own personal interactions with Grace but it's crucial to remember that Grace isn't being exclusively granted to our Tarnished.
The intro cinematic introduces us to Godfrey (Hoarah Loux), Goldmask, Fia, Dung Eater, and Gideon. All of these characters are Tarnished like us, and like us they were Granted their Grace.
So what happens to these NPCs?
Hoarah Loux follows his guidance which ultimately leads him to you. This is directly in the text. You defeat him, and I think the line "thy strength befits a crown" is him reconciling with the fact he is not stronger than you. I think Hourah Loux's "Order" is the current one, he represents mending the Elden Ring as it is. He already helped create this order.
Goldmask is killed by Corrhyn, but only after fulfilling his own grace: finding the Perfect Order. He's the only one that sees the flaw in the Golden Order and once he fixes it, he has no purpose. He produces a Mending Rune, that was his guidance.
Fia takes other Tarnished Vigor and her own and attempts to revive Godwyn. You can enter her dream (why? what?) and you find Fortissax who has been fighting against death inside Godwyn since the Night of the Black Knives. Defeating Fortissax here I believe allows Fia to retrieve Godwyn's half of the curse mark and Fia produces the Mending Rune of the Death-Prince, and "embeds the principle of life within Death into Order." "The Golden Order was created by confining Destined Death. Thus, this new Order will be one of Death restored."
Dung Eater's purpose is to also create a Mending Rune to alter the current Order. First what he believes he must do is spread the seedbed curses to everyone he can. If he does this enough, then every corpse he defiles cannot return to the Erdtree. But you convince him, by defeating him that you are the one destined to become Elden lord, and only you can fix the order in his vision and he has to gestate the mending rune for you.
Gideon is fucking weird in this theory. I'm not sure what his guidance is. He is out to just collect knowledge and seems to have eyes and ears everywhere. Maybe his purpose is to guide the player? He doesn't have an alignment other than his own. He doesn't have an idea of the order that he wants, just that he has glimpsed what he believes Marika has planned (in reality he glimpsed into Radagon's will. Gideon does not know that Radagon is Marika) and believes the Tarnished are just running upstream
I believe he has lost his guidance when he faces you. If his purpose is to collect knowledge to eventually share with the eventual Elden Lord, then him facing you when you're right at the cusp of doing that would make sense.
We know guidance is something that can be lost. Nepheli and Boggart both claim to have lost it. Roderika has the red hood so she never saw the guidance, and she even says she doesn't know her purpose. Its implied heavily that Corrhyn can't see it. He never confirms he can, and if you kill him he says "O guidance...of grace... Why...can't I.." Rogier says he can't see it anymore. D might still see it, he never says he does. It's just that he hunts Those That Live In Death at the guidance of grace because they go against the current order. Bernahl actively rejects grace and winds up at the manor. Same with Varre, although Varre might be native and just have knowledge of grace.
The reason I established first what Grace is guiding us towards before who is guiding our Grace, is because we have a map where we can trace out the path Grace is guiding us on. We can easily draw a conclusion viewing the map as to what Grace is guiding us towards without ever getting into the whom is granting Grace.
Alright so we have arrived at the big contentious question, who bestows Grace? Who is guiding the Tarnished?
The main argument for Grace's return to the Tarnished coming from Marika are the spoken words Melina shares with us at the Third Church of Marika & the Church of Pilgrimage. Here's what she shares:

Third Church:
Very well. In Marika's own words. My Lord, and thy warriors. I divest each of thee of thy grace. With thine eyes dimmed, ye will be driven from the Lands Between. Ye will wage war in a land afar, where ye will live, and die.
Church of Pilgrimage:
Then, after thy death, I will give back what I once claimed. Return to the Lands Between, wage war, and brandish the Elden Ring. Grow strong in the face of death. Warriors of my lord. Lord Godfrey.

I wouldn't fault you if you came across these two pieces of dialogue and drew the conclusion that Marika is restoring Grace to the Tarnished. She basically lays out her plan - but remember this dialogue had to have taken place before her marriage to Radagon. You wouldn't be crazy to assume that this was a conversation with Godfrey and his army right before they were sent away. There are so many things that happened between Godfrey being banished and Marika shattering the Elden Ring. Ask yourself this, does this sound more like Marika prophesizing the next few centuries or does it seem like Marika was taking out an insurance policy in case shit goes south? If you chose prophecy - then you have to wrestle with the fact that she would have to also know that Godwyn was going to be assassinated, she would shatter the Elden Ring and be immediately imprisoned, her children would break out in war with no clear winner, THEN Grace would be returned to the Tarnished.
I don't think that sounds very logical. Marika keeping a backup army ready and willing to commit genocide in the event someone turns on her requires less assumptions, even if in itself it is also an assumption.
The dialogue with Enia confirms that Marika has been imprisoned within the Erdtree since the Shattering. We see her in this state and she barely looks like a living being. She's fractured, has a spear resembling Destined Death penetrating her abdomen, and she's being crucified. This imagery does not signal "hey I can still do stuff" If you believe Marika returned our Grace then you have to have an answer as to why it didn't happen immediately following her shattering the Elden Ring, and you would need to explain the long gap between the Shattering and the end of the Shattering War. Why wait centuries after you went the nuclear option to call in back up?
I think it's safe to assume Marika hasn't had any affect or influence on anything since she successfully shattered the Elden Ring. She's incapacitated - she's practically stone. She's not returning Grace to anyone, because she's now a glorified trophy case for the Elden Ring. Also, an important thing to consider while we talk about Marika, there's no reason to believe that Marika has exclusive control over Grace. All of Marika's power derives from the fact that she was chosen for Godhood by the GW. Anything she is able to do with Grace is because of the GW. It is not crazy to make the assumption that the Greater Will can manipulate and grant Grace to all the living beings in The Lands Between just like Marika can.
We've already poked a few holes in the Marika theory by establishing the timeline of events. Marika probably did not return Grace to the Tarnished because she has been incapacitated in the Erdtree since she shattered the Elden Ring. If you believe otherwise, then there has to exist some sort of explanation as to why she would wait for the Shattering War to come to a stalemate before returning Grace. That's icky and requires too many assumptions that won't have any concrete answers.
A popular theory I see spewed about Marika returning Grace is this assumption that she has been aiding Ranni so that the Greater Will can finally be usurped. She returned Grace to the Tarnished to help Ranni achieve the Age of Stars. Ok, but we have a map that we can tangibly see where exactly Grace has been guiding us to. I did a rough count and my math sucks, but I counted 53 sites of Grace that are spewing a guiding light. Out of 53, four are directly tied to leading us towards Ranni. 3 are guiding us to and through Caria Manor as well as one more guiding us to Renna's Rise from Ranni's bed chamber. If Marika did return our Grace, and Marika did aid us in helping the Demigod that murdered her firstborn child, then why do we not see Grace guiding us throughout Ranni's quest? There's no guiding light anywhere in Nokron or Nokstella.
Grace IS guiding us to all known Shardbearers and Great Runes. That is a fact, besides 1-2 specific paths none of which have anything to do with Ranni whatsoever.
So, if we know Grace is guiding us towards Great Runes and you believe Marika is the one who granted Grace, then you have to wrestle with the notion that Marika shattered the Elden Ring, let her children wage war, and then decided to grant Grace back to the Tarnished only for them to go around, collect all the Great Runes, and become her 3rd consort and repair the Elden Ring. Why would Marika want this? All this accomplishes is getting Marika imprisoned eternally in the Erdtree. Why would she shatter the Elden Ring to just have her insurance policy army come in centuries later and immediately restore order and put things back to the way they were? That makes no sense.
Grace is leading the Tarnished of no Renown to the Shardbearers so that we will become the next Elden Lord and restore Order. The other Tarnished that are mentioned in some way shape or form either aid in the production of producing mending Runes (Dung Eater, Fia, Goldmask) or aiding our character in his journey to become Elden Lord. (Gideon) Godfrey is the only Tarnished that could have potentially bested us in battle – and fights for his right to reclaim the title he once held.
If we were to simplify our answer to the question, “What is the role Grace is playing in guiding the Tarnished?”
Repair the Elden Ring and restore Order.
We know this occurred AFTER The Shattering War once the Greater Will abandoned the Demigods.

Enia
"Look there. The Fingers tremble. To welcome you, shardbearer. Let their wisdom wash over you. "Great Elden Ring, root of the Golden Order. Anchor of all lands, giver of grace, wellspring of all joy. Until it was shattered. The tragic corruption of the Order has taken its toll. Across the realm, life lies in ruin. Fallen to pieces. Foul curses and misery spread, unabating. But the Greater Will has not abandoned the realm, nor the life that inhabits it. So it is that the Tarnished are guided by grace. Called to act. Brave Tarnished, your Great Rune is a handsome shard of the Elden Ring. Seek another of its kind. To become Elden Lord, and restore the Golden Order". Let the words of the Fingers guide you".
Ahh, Great Runes are the stuff of demigods: the children of the goddess, Queen Marika. She who is vessel of the Elden Ring. Tainted by the strength of their runes, her children warred, but none could become Elden Lord. And so grace was extended, to your kind, the Tarnished".
"Listen, the Fingers speak. "The Greater Will has long renounced the demigods. Tarnished, show no mercy. Have their heads. Take all they have left." ...Indeed.

The Greater Will is the one who wants the Elden Ring repaired and Order Restored. After the stalemate of the Shattering War, the Greater Will gave up on the Demigods. After the abandonment of the Demigods is when Grace is returned to the Tarnished by the Greater Will. We are tasked with slaying the Shardbearers, reach the Erdtree, repair the Elden Ring and restore Order. The other Tarnished we meet either aids us in our quest, challenges us for the throne, or is used to producing Runes that can be used to repair the Elden Ring.
Whether you decide to use a Mending Rune or not, upon the defeat of the Elden Beast – you get to shape the next upcoming age. You decide what will or will not be included in your Order. Remember, the Greater Will does not care what the Order looks like, it just wants An Order. This is further supported by the Empyreans.

Gowry:
Queen Marika and her King Consort Radagon were blessed with twin demigods, and Malenia was one of them. She was born an Empyrean, carrying the scarlet rot. An Empyrean...is no mere demigod. In the age of the Elden Ring, and Queen Marika, the precious Empyrean was born. A new god to forge a new Order. Since Malenia fought Radahn, and the great scarlet flower blossomed in Aeonia, I have dedicated myself to her. And to the resplendence of the Order of Rot. The cycle of decay and rebirth."
Ranni:
Let us speak of the past, a while. I was once an Empyrean. Of the demigods, only I, Miquella, and Malenia could claim that title. Each of us was chosen by our own Two Fingers, as a candidate to succeed Queen Marika, to become the new god of the coming age. Which is when I received Blaidd. In the form of a vassal tailored for an Empyrean.

Empyreans are chosen as candidates to succeed Marika and become the new God of the coming Age. The point I’m making with this is Ranni, Malenia, and Miquella all differ drastically from the current order. Malenia is cursed from the Outer God of Rot, yet was still chosen. Ranni is the embodiment of the Moon, yet was still chosen. Dung Eater wants to spread the Omen curse so far and wide – it is no longer seen as a curse. Fia wants to restore death to Order. Goldmask wants to remove the fickleness of Gods to perfect Order. Godfrey wants to restore the Age he fought hard to establish. That makes 3 Empyreans, 3 Mending Runes, and 1 Tarnished fighting for the Age he is responsible for. That is seven completely different Orders. To reiterate again, as long as it’s Order – The Greater Will does not care how it looks.
TL:DR The Greater Will is guiding the Tarnished to repair the Elden Ring and restore Order through the Guidance of Grace.

I've started a new character and have made a few attempts at getting there myself but haven't been able to make it past the belfries. For anyone that wants to help the grace site will be the first step

Trying not to lose my cool in front of my cats but I'm getting slapped around by the hands and I've dropped my runes twice.
Site of grace: Main Caria Manor Gate
Pw: gomer

I've engaged in a few conversations with people in the community regarding Grace. It seems to me that there are two camps - those who believe it was Marika that returned the guidance of Grace to the Tarnished, and those who believe this was done by the Greater Will.
Firstly, what is Grace? Mechanically it is a feature to guide the player towards objectives laid out by ______. Grace allows us to rest, gives us an opportunity to turn our runes into strength, and appears to us as a guiding light towards various things in the world. Pretty easy explanation for a game mechanic to help establish check points and a bit of a 'nudge' on where to go in a vast open world. It's also what allows us to 'respawn' after dying. FROM being the beautiful lil BAMFs that they are - wanted to give these mechanics meaning and story to justify their existence. That brings us to a second question - what is Grace from a lore perspective? This seems like a question that can be easily answered the same way the first question was explained, but mechanics aside this allows us to ask a few additional questions.
What is Grace leading us to?
Why are we led to the things Grace leads us to?
When did this start? When was Grace returned?
Who blessed us with Grace?
I'm going break down my interpretation of Grace in the post below. Feel free to agree or disagree - I love conversations about lore. My interpretation of the story and lore is constantly evolving when I'm exposed to new theories so I welcome the discussion!
A couple of NPC's speak to us about Grace throughout the game. Melina and Varre both explain Grace to us at the start of our journey.

White mask Varre:
Are you familiar with grace? The golden light that gives life to you Tarnished. You may also behold its golden rays pointing in a particular direction at times. That is the guidance of grace. The path that a Tarnished must travel. Mm, indeed. Grace's guidance holds the answers. It will lead you Tarnished to the path you are meant to follow. Even if it leads you to your grave.
Melina:
This tiny golden aura is the grace of the Erdtree. This light once shone in the eyes of your Tarnished brethren. But now it is all that guides you. Or so I hear. The rays of grace, that guide you through your burden. Upon the cliff, in Castle Stormveil, is a shardbearer. A demigod who inherited a fragment of the shattered Elden Ring. If the rays of grace signal the castle, then the Elden Ring beckons you. As an ally by pact,...I pray that you are fit... To face the challenge presented by the Ring.

Grace is what gives the Tarnished life, and allows us to resurrect after we die, as well as a guide through the Lands Between.
What are we being guided to? Well, let's take a look.
Limgrave
Liurnia
Caelid
Altus Plateau
Mountaintops
Underground
Seems pretty consistent if you ask me. We're clearly being guided to Demigods and shardbearers. Something wants us to claim Great Runes and slay the remaining demigods. There are 3 outliers with Grace that this doesn't really fit. Castle Morne doesn't really have anything that pertains to the goal of becoming Elden Lord besides getting stronger. Church of the Plague in Caelid hosts Millicent. She has a quest that could in theory lead to an Age of Rot (not a foolproof theory but that is how I interprete what Gowry is using Millicent for) Castle Sol is another funky one. I suppose you could claim this is leading us to Malenia. Still rather meh but let's keep going.
We've established what Grace is doing, as well as where it's leading us. Let's see if there's anything that could possibly pinpoint us as to when Grace was returned to us.
Let's consult the opening cinematic that plays when you select New Game

The fallen leaves tell a story.
The great Elden Ring was shattered.
In our home, across the fog, the Lands Between.
Now, Queen Marika the Eternal is nowhere to be found,
and in the Night of the Black Knives, Godwyn the Golden was the first to perish.
Soon, Marika's offspring, demigods all, claimed the shards of the Elden Ring.
The mad taint of their newfound strength triggered the Shattering.
A war from which no lord arose.
A war leading to abandonment by the Greater Will.
Arise now, ye Tarnished.
Ye dead, who yet live.
The call of long-lost grace speaks to us all.
Hoarah Loux, chieftan of the badlands.
The ever-brilliant Goldmask.
Fia, the Deathbed Companion.
The loathsome Dung Eater.
And Sir Gideon Ofnir, the All-knowing.
And one other. Whom grace would again bless.
A Tarnished of no renown.
Cross the fog, to the Lands Between.
To stand before the Elden Ring.
And become the Elden Lord.

This is the first exposition given to us - the Shattering War ended in a stalemate leading to the Greater Will abandoning the Demigods. The next thing it shows is Grace being returned to the Tarnished. This establishes pretty firmly that the Tarnished weren't called back until after The Shattering. The Greater Will abandoned the Demigods then proceeds to show Grace being returned to the Tarnished.
Also note that it says Marika is nowhere to be found since the Elden Ring was shattered. Enia backs this up when we speak to her about this:

Queen Marika is the vessel of the Elden Ring, carrier of its vision. A god, in truth. But after the Elden Ring's shattering, she was imprisoned in the Erdtree. A grim punishment for shattering the Order, despite her godhood. The Fingers speak...
"Marika's trespass demanded a heavy sentence. But even in shackles, she remains a god, and the vision's vessel. Confer Great Runes to become Elden Lord, and join Queen Marika as her consort. The Fingers have willed it so"

It's easy to get caught up in our own personal interactions with Grace but it's crucial to remember that Grace isn't being exclusively granted to our Tarnished.
The intro cinematic introduces us to Godfrey (Hoarah Loux), Goldmask, Fia, Dung Eater, and Gideon. All of these characters are Tarnished like us, and like us they were Granted their Grace.
So what happens to these NPCs?
Hoarah Loux follows his guidance which ultimately leads him to you. This is directly in the text. You defeat him, and I think the line "thy strength befits a crown" is him reconciling with the fact he is not stronger than you. I think Hourah Loux's "Order" is the current one, he represents mending the Elden Ring as it is. He already helped create this order.
Goldmask is killed by Corrhyn, but only after fulfilling his own grace: finding the Perfect Order. He's the only one that sees the flaw in the Golden Order and once he fixes it, he has no purpose. He produces a Mending Rune, that was his guidance.
Fia takes other Tarnished Vigor and her own and attempts to revive Godwyn. You can enter her dream (why? what?) and you find Fortissax who has been fighting against death inside Godwyn since the Night of the Black Knives. Defeating Fortissax here I believe allows Fia to retrieve Godwyn's half of the curse mark and Fia produces the Mending Rune of the Death-Prince, and "embeds the principle of life within Death into Order." "The Golden Order was created by confining Destined Death. Thus, this new Order will be one of Death restored."
Dung Eater's purpose is to also create a Mending Rune to alter the current Order. First what he believes he must do is spread the seedbed curses to everyone he can. If he does this enough, then every corpse he defiles cannot return to the Erdtree. But you convince him, by defeating him that you are the one destined to become Elden lord, and only you can fix the order in his vision and he has to gestate the mending rune for you.
Gideon is fucking weird in this theory. I'm not sure what his guidance is. He is out to just collect knowledge and seems to have eyes and ears everywhere. Maybe his purpose is to guide the player? He doesn't have an alignment other than his own. He doesn't have an idea of the order that he wants, just that he has glimpsed what he believes Marika has planned (in reality he glimpsed into Radagon's will. Gideon does not know that Radagon is Marika) and believes the Tarnished are just running upstream
I believe he has lost his guidance when he faces you. If his purpose is to collect knowledge to eventually share with the eventual Elden Lord, then him facing you when you're right at the cusp of doing that would make sense.
We know guidance is something that can be lost. Nepheli and Boggart both claim to have lost it. Roderika has the red hood so she never saw the guidance, and she even says she doesn't know her purpose. Its implied heavily that Corrhyn can't see it. He never confirms he can, and if you kill him he says "O guidance...of grace... Why...can't I.." Rogier says he can't see it anymore. D might still see it, he never says he does. It's just that he hunts Those That Live In Death at the guidance of grace because they go against the current order. Bernahl actively rejects grace and winds up at the manor. Same with Varre, although Varre might be native and just have knowledge of grace.
The reason I established first what Grace is guiding us towards before who is guiding our Grace, is because we have a map where we can trace out the path Grace is guiding us on. We can easily draw a conclusion viewing the map as to what Grace is guiding us towards without ever getting into the whom is granting Grace.
Alright so we have arrived at the big contentious question, who bestows Grace? Who is guiding the Tarnished?
The main argument for Grace's return to the Tarnished coming from Marika are the spoken words Melina shares with us at the Third Church of Marika & the Church of Pilgrimage. Here's what she shares:

Third Church:
Very well. In Marika's own words. My Lord, and thy warriors. I divest each of thee of thy grace. With thine eyes dimmed, ye will be driven from the Lands Between. Ye will wage war in a land afar, where ye will live, and die.
Church of Pilgrimage:
Then, after thy death, I will give back what I once claimed. Return to the Lands Between, wage war, and brandish the Elden Ring. Grow strong in the face of death. Warriors of my lord. Lord Godfrey.

I wouldn't fault you if you came across these two pieces of dialogue and drew the conclusion that Marika is restoring Grace to the Tarnished. She basically lays out her plan - but remember this dialogue had to have taken place before her marriage to Radagon. You wouldn't be crazy to assume that this was a conversation with Godfrey and his army right before they were sent away. There are so many things that happened between Godfrey being banished and Marika shattering the Elden Ring. Ask yourself this, does this sound more like Marika prophesizing the next few centuries or does it seem like Marika was taking out an insurance policy in case shit goes south? If you chose prophecy - then you have to wrestle with the fact that she would have to also know that Godwyn was going to be assassinated, she would shatter the Elden Ring and be immediately imprisoned, her children would break out in war with no clear winner, THEN Grace would be returned to the Tarnished.
I don't think that sounds very logical. Marika keeping a backup army ready and willing to commit genocide in the event someone turns on her requires less assumptions, even if in itself it is also an assumption.
The dialogue with Enia confirms that Marika has been imprisoned within the Erdtree since the Shattering. We see her in this state and she barely looks like a living being. She's fractured, has a spear resembling Destined Death penetrating her abdomen, and she's being crucified. This imagery does not signal "hey I can still do stuff" If you believe Marika returned our Grace then you have to have an answer as to why it didn't happen immediately following her shattering the Elden Ring, and you would need to explain the long gap between the Shattering and the end of the Shattering War. Why wait centuries after you went the nuclear option to call in back up?
I think it's safe to assume Marika hasn't had any affect or influence on anything since she successfully shattered the Elden Ring. She's incapacitated - she's practically stone. She's not returning Grace to anyone, because she's now a glorified trophy case for the Elden Ring. Also, an important thing to consider while we talk about Marika, there's no reason to believe that Marika has exclusive control over Grace. All of Marika's power derives from the fact that she was chosen for Godhood by the GW. Anything she is able to do with Grace is because of the GW. It is not crazy to make the assumption that the Greater Will can manipulate and grant Grace to all the living beings in The Lands Between just like Marika can.
We've already poked a few holes in the Marika theory by establishing the timeline of events. Marika probably did not return Grace to the Tarnished because she has been incapacitated in the Erdtree since she shattered the Elden Ring. If you believe otherwise, then there has to exist some sort of explanation as to why she would wait for the Shattering War to come to a stalemate before returning Grace. That's icky and requires too many assumptions that won't have any concrete answers.
A popular theory I see spewed about Marika returning Grace is this assumption that she has been aiding Ranni so that the Greater Will can finally be usurped. She returned Grace to the Tarnished to help Ranni achieve the Age of Stars. Ok, but we have a map that we can tangibly see where exactly Grace has been guiding us to. I did a rough count and my math sucks, but I counted 53 sites of Grace that are spewing a guiding light. Out of 53, four are directly tied to leading us towards Ranni. 3 are guiding us to and through Caria Manor as well as one more guiding us to Renna's Rise from Ranni's bed chamber. If Marika did return our Grace, and Marika did aid us in helping the Demigod that murdered her firstborn child, then why do we not see Grace guiding us throughout Ranni's quest? There's no guiding light anywhere in Nokron or Nokstella.
Grace IS guiding us to all known Shardbearers and Great Runes. That is a fact, besides 1-2 specific paths none of which have anything to do with Ranni whatsoever.
So, if we know Grace is guiding us towards Great Runes and you believe Marika is the one who granted Grace, then you have to wrestle with the notion that Marika shattered the Elden Ring, let her children wage war, and then decided to grant Grace back to the Tarnished only for them to go around, collect all the Great Runes, and become her 3rd consort and repair the Elden Ring. Why would Marika want this? All this accomplishes is getting Marika imprisoned eternally in the Erdtree. Why would she shatter the Elden Ring to just have her insurance policy army come in centuries later and immediately restore order and put things back to the way they were? That makes no sense.
Grace is leading the Tarnished of no Renown to the Shardbearers so that we will become the next Elden Lord and restore Order. The other Tarnished that are mentioned in some way shape or form either aid in the production of producing mending Runes (Dung Eater, Fia, Goldmask) or aiding our character in his journey to become Elden Lord. (Gideon) Godfrey is the only Tarnished that could have potentially bested us in battle – and fights for his right to reclaim the title he once held.
If we were to simplify our answer to the question, “What is the role Grace is playing in guiding the Tarnished?”
Repair the Elden Ring and restore Order.
We know this occurred AFTER The Shattering War once the Greater Will abandoned the Demigods.

Enia
"Look there. The Fingers tremble. To welcome you, shardbearer. Let their wisdom wash over you. "Great Elden Ring, root of the Golden Order. Anchor of all lands, giver of grace, wellspring of all joy. Until it was shattered. The tragic corruption of the Order has taken its toll. Across the realm, life lies in ruin. Fallen to pieces. Foul curses and misery spread, unabating. But the Greater Will has not abandoned the realm, nor the life that inhabits it. So it is that the Tarnished are guided by grace. Called to act. Brave Tarnished, your Great Rune is a handsome shard of the Elden Ring. Seek another of its kind. To become Elden Lord, and restore the Golden Order". Let the words of the Fingers guide you".
Ahh, Great Runes are the stuff of demigods: the children of the goddess, Queen Marika. She who is vessel of the Elden Ring. Tainted by the strength of their runes, her children warred, but none could become Elden Lord. And so grace was extended, to your kind, the Tarnished".
"Listen, the Fingers speak. "The Greater Will has long renounced the demigods. Tarnished, show no mercy. Have their heads. Take all they have left." ...Indeed.

The Greater Will is the one who wants the Elden Ring repaired and Order Restored. After the stalemate of the Shattering War, the Greater Will gave up on the Demigods. After the abandonment of the Demigods is when Grace is returned to the Tarnished by the Greater Will. We are tasked with slaying the Shardbearers, reach the Erdtree, repair the Elden Ring and restore Order. The other Tarnished we meet either aids us in our quest, challenges us for the throne, or is used to producing Runes that can be used to repair the Elden Ring.
Whether you decide to use a Mending Rune or not, upon the defeat of the Elden Beast – you get to shape the next upcoming age. You decide what will or will not be included in your Order. Remember, the Greater Will does not care what the Order looks like, it just wants An Order. This is further supported by the Empyreans.

Gowry:
Queen Marika and her King Consort Radagon were blessed with twin demigods, and Malenia was one of them. She was born an Empyrean, carrying the scarlet rot. An Empyrean...is no mere demigod. In the age of the Elden Ring, and Queen Marika, the precious Empyrean was born. A new god to forge a new Order. Since Malenia fought Radahn, and the great scarlet flower blossomed in Aeonia, I have dedicated myself to her. And to the resplendence of the Order of Rot. The cycle of decay and rebirth."
Ranni:
Let us speak of the past, a while. I was once an Empyrean. Of the demigods, only I, Miquella, and Malenia could claim that title. Each of us was chosen by our own Two Fingers, as a candidate to succeed Queen Marika, to become the new god of the coming age. Which is when I received Blaidd. In the form of a vassal tailored for an Empyrean.

Empyreans are chosen as candidates to succeed Marika and become the new God of the coming Age. The point I’m making with this is Ranni, Malenia, and Miquella all differ drastically from the current order. Malenia is cursed from the Outer God of Rot, yet was still chosen. Ranni is the embodiment of the Moon, yet was still chosen. Dung Eater wants to spread the Omen curse so far and wide – it is no longer seen as a curse. Fia wants to restore death to Order. Goldmask wants to remove the fickleness of Gods to perfect Order. Godfrey wants to restore the Age he fought hard to establish. That makes 3 Empyreans, 3 Mending Runes, and 1 Tarnished fighting for the Age he is responsible for. That is seven completely different Orders. To reiterate again, as long as it’s Order – The Greater Will does not care how it looks.
TL:DR The Greater Will is guiding the Tarnished to repair the Elden Ring and restore Order through the Guidance of Grace.

If you know where the goodies are that's great but not a huge deal. I just prefer to play this game with other people. Also i suck.
I'm at the main gate grace.
Password is storm

can anyone help out with this bit the hands are annoying😂 im just at the main entrance at the grace for caria manor! happy to carry on and do a bit more aswell after the boss. Password is 334455